Fear of tell tale sounds in sample libraries

[beats me]

I'm really liking what I'm hearing in NI's Evolving Mutations sample libraries. I really like those epic industrial movie soundtrack type tracks but to date haven't really been able to pull that sound off myself, but I haven't really put much effort towards that either. The 2 NI Kontakt libraries sound like they nailed this sound in a nifty little bundle.

But even more than using presets in a softsynth my concern would be that these libraries have even more obvious sounds that would point to laziness or done to death. It says it has sliced samples as well as loops but I really don't know how flexible you can be on manipulation and making things sound less stock and more like your own unique creation.

Anybody have any experience with these type libraries? Is there some real creative possibilities or is it something that would be more attractive to people with jobs in soundtrack production with tight deadlines.

[ethios4]

I think the only people that care about that kind of thing are other musicians, who make up maybe 0.05% of the population.

How about the Amen drum break....the most used sample ever, spawning entire genres....it's all about how you use it. Chopped, pitched, sliced, stretched, distorted, granulated, etc.

[beats me]

I think the only people that care about that kind of thing are other musicians, who make up maybe 0.05% of the population.

How about the Amen drum break....the most used sample ever, spawning entire genres....it's all about how you use it. Chopped, pitched, sliced, stretched, distorted, granulated, etc.

I remember back during the height of mp3.com there was an artist that was doing really well in the electronica charts. I was really impressed that a 19-year-old was releasing some real quality tracks. We spoke on and off and I eventually found out that his music was 100% pre-made ACID loops. He neither advertised nor denied that fact and the public just liked what they liked, didn't care about what was behind it.

Plus I imagine my posts on here would be a lot more diabolical when I'm typing with my left hand while playing Resident Evil style loops with my right.

[john doe by choice]

I love those type of sound libraries, but then, I'm into cinematic IDM...I love Burial's stuff, and a lot of other moody, atmospheric dubstep. I'd say that it's good for that, but I don't know how much use the average techno producer is going to get out of it - I hear a lot of this atmosphere in old Mo Wax cuts, and in stuff like UNKLE's Psyence Fiction and some of DJ Krush's old albums. A lot of it is sound design, layered elements...a lot of reverb, people out there getting dirty with their field recorders, then coming back and layering it up with conventional instruments. However, this sort of stuff is excellent for Resident Evil style loops. Or Silent Hill style loops, whichever you prefer.

I will say that I'm inclined toward getting the pre-sale pack of Evolve 1 and 2 - when companies work with NI to make Kontakt instruments, they usually turn out fairly well, although, I have to say, I miss not being able to use Intakt and Kompakt on my Mac - I very much liked having everything right there in the instrument, up front instead of hidden in Kontakt's tabs, drop-downs, and other feeble attempts at conserving screen space.

[beats me]

I just got a $30 coupon from NI so I'm leaning towards getting the bundle.

They would have been a little more attractive at kore pack pricing of $60. The individual price of $119 each and even the bundle price of $170 seems like a bit much for something so niche that I'm not making money on, but the video and audio demos do seem impressive and flexible.

[UKRuss]

It's not only musicians that care about it, but I'd add it's mainly amateur musicians that get funny about loops and samples.

The majority of pro videos I see on future music DVds and the like use vegenance samples and loops without a care in the world.

I say go for it, make things easier on yourself. not everythiung has to be made from scratch for you to make satisfying music. Have fun. Leave the rest for amateur internet musicians to argue over.

[john doe by choice]

Yeah, I'm in film school, so something like that pays itself off on assignments/demo reel alone for me, but I can't see people out of the industry getting it - it's just a little dark for most popular music.

You may want to get on the east west mailing list, too - they had a pretty crazy group buy for their email list a few weeks ago, and the end price was just ridiculous - $200 for a ridiculous amount of samples, and since I had a little mis-communication with them, they hooked me up on their new Dark Skies/Cinematic Ambiences, which is really nice so far. My only let down with east/west is that they actually stopped working with NI a while back, so they don't have nicely made Kontakt instruments, their stuff just uses the standard interface, which just doesn't do it for me.

[beats me]

I don't write techno or pop music so I don't have any delusions of creating some kind of soundtrack dance hybrid music. I cut my teeth on metal, then industrial, and now a little more ambient down tempo. So if anything this library would be going more towards my roots.

I've looked into East West libraries but the price has always seemed a little price prohibitive for me and I've heard bad things about their proprietary player.

[john doe by choice]

I wouldn't buy anything from them if they didn't include .nki's of all of their stuff - the proprietary player is new, and I'm not getting involved in it - Kontakt is enough.


You might enjoy these guys, if you're getting into this sound:

http://www.spectraliquid.com/

Two acts on there, BlackFilm and Frank Riggio, are really good. There's also a bunch of dubstep, which I realize is hit and miss with a lot of people, but I would at least check out Blackfilm.

[beats me]

I wouldn't buy anything from them if they didn't include .nki's of all of their stuff - the proprietary player is new, and I'm not getting involved in it - Kontakt is enough.


You might enjoy these guys, if you're getting into this sound:

http://www.spectraliquid.com/

Two acts on there, BlackFilm and Frank Riggio, are really good. There's also a bunch of dubstep, which I realize is hit and miss with a lot of people, but I would at least check out Blackfilm.

Cool. Checking out now. Thanks for the recommendation.

[ikeaboy]

I think the only people that care about that kind of thing are other musicians, who make up maybe 0.05% of the population.

How about the Amen drum break....the most used sample ever, spawning entire genres....it's all about how you use it. Chopped, pitched, sliced, stretched, distorted, granulated, etc.

I remember back during the height of mp3.com there was an artist that was doing really well in the electronica charts. I was really impressed that a 19-year-old was releasing some real quality tracks. We spoke on and off and I eventually found out that his music was 100% pre-made ACID loops. He neither advertised nor denied that fact and the public just liked what they liked, didn't care about what was behind it.

Plus I imagine my posts on here would be a lot more diabolical when I'm typing with my left hand while playing Resident Evil style loops with my right.

If he's taking the glory from other peoples work thats pretty shallow. Then again talent borrows genius steals. I use the odd 3rd party loop f'ck it

[ethios4]

If he's taking the glory from other peoples work thats pretty shallow. Then again talent borrows genius steals. I use the odd 3rd party loop f'ck it

3rd party loops are meant to be used. No need to give credit or royalties. What's funny is when you buy a loop pack and find out that it has stolen samples in it!

[ikeaboy]

If he's taking the glory from other peoples work thats pretty shallow. Then again talent borrows genius steals. I use the odd 3rd party loop f'ck it

3rd party loops are meant to be used. No need to give credit or royalties. What's funny is when you buy a loop pack and find out that it has stolen samples in it!

Doesn't it grind your gears a bit when people assemble tracks out them entirely? They're invaluable to professionals who haven't got time to worry about sound design, i.e. people in advertising but they deffinately aren't a satisfying to me as using my own creativity (even if that creativity is subconsciously ripping off my own influences)

[beats me]

If he's taking the glory from other peoples work thats pretty shallow. Then again talent borrows genius steals. I use the odd 3rd party loop f'ck it

3rd party loops are meant to be used. No need to give credit or royalties. What's funny is when you buy a loop pack and find out that it has stolen samples in it!

Doesn't it grind your gears a bit when people assemble tracks out them entirely? They're invaluable to professionals who haven't got time to worry about sound design, i.e. people in advertising but they deffinately aren't a satisfying to me as using my own creativity (even if that creativity is subconsciously ripping off my own influences)

I had no issues with the guy on a personal level and he was just using Acid to make some songs he liked and was sharing them with the world, but the issue was this. Back then mp3.com was paying artists just based on plays per day. So for awhile on average he was making $50 - $60 per day for nothing more than people listening, and like with any chart based system you will get more attention and more listens simply because you are on the top of the charts and that will keep you there.

Back then software was still in it's infancy and Acid was a fairly basic program. So you had some artists that didn't have a big budget to go into a studio and processing was still largely hardware based which can also be expensive and maybe their production skills weren't up to par for any variety of reasons. Then you have somebody that is using nothing but professionally made loops who is kicking your ass on the charts and filling up their bank account. It would be like the top charting artist on beatport using nothing but Vengeance loops.

Like I said, nothing personal against the guy, but on a purely music, production, and money earning level I don't think that's too cool.

[ethios4]

I see it as a continuum of sorts. On one extreme end you have the person who creates every single sound, using homemade synths, written in Csound...every single element is original. At the other end of the spectrum is the DJ who plays other people's tracks back to back with no mixing. So the Acid loops guy is close to the DJ...he's taking other people's loops and mixing them creatively, focusing on the arrangement of materials only, not on creating the materials. I'm closer to the other end, but I sometimes use loops and samples from libraries, synth presets. I like to create the most prominent elements from scratch though.

I remember seeing some video of some douchebag producer in the studio...don't remember who, maybe like Badboy Bill or some shit....he just walked around the studio listening in on what these other 3 guys were doing, saying "yea, that's cool lets use that", and "hey why don't you use that one loop for that part". He did nothing whatsoever himself except for one part where he recorded a few seconds of a record scratch and that was all. Now I could see that being a cool way to work...he's sort of like the director of a movie...except the music was totally lame generic dance music, nothing original or groundbreaking or technically impressive about it at all. He was making a lot of money though.