Mono Vs Stereo Channels- Im confused

[16 BIT]

I read somewhere in the Live manual that mono signals are duplicated so that in effect means we have a pseudo stereo channel. Nothing wrong with that I think?, but doesnt this mean that mono channels which should only play one file then becomes a stereo channel playing 2 files. (pseudo stereo)

If this is correct doesnt this mean a waste of HD-CPU resources.?

Ive always wondered why a mono sample shows 2 green leds on the mixer when other daws I have used only show 1 (as it should be)

I was loading some mono files from a Cubase project and they would only come out of one channel panned hard to the left. Nothing I did could make the signal come through both speakers. So I had to render, hit convert to Mono, import back in and then the signal played through both speakers BUT with 2 led lights indicating a stereo signal


Am I missing something here?

[16 BIT]

Come on this is really important. Someone must have an idea if this is correct?

+ its a sunday and Im bored

[Alex]

Hi 16 BIT,

but doesnt this mean that mono channels which should only play one file then becomes a stereo channel playing 2 files. (pseudo stereo)

in principle, yes. When playing a physical mono audio file, the both channels of the Live's Audio track are fed with the same mono signal.

If this is correct doesnt this mean a waste of HD-CPU resources.?

The HD-resources makes no difference because in a mono channel there is only one channel of data to read from the disk. Concerning the CPU resources you are right.

Ive always wondered why a mono sample shows 2 green leds on the mixer when other daws I have used only show 1 (as it should be)

More than less the same answer, Live offers only stereo tracks, and therefore you have also two meters when you play a physical mono audio file.

I was loading some mono files from a Cubase project and they would only come out of one channel panned hard to the left. Nothing I did could make the signal come through both speakers. So I had to render, hit convert to Mono, import back in and then the signal played through both speakers BUT with 2 led lights indicating a stereo signal

I do not understand this. If you have a physical mono file you should hear it on both channels, but if you have a physical stereo file where the left channels is filled and the right channel is empty, you hear it only on the left speaker.
How looks the waveform of the mono file from Cubase? Is it really one channel?

regards,
Alex

[GUEST]

The output of any track is always stereo. That's what the meters represent. The input to a track may be a mono signal from, say, a guitar, bass, etc and that signal can be set to mono by going to Preferences>Audio and hitting the Input Config button.

If the source is a Wav file then the same rules apply but are automatic. If a signal shows up on one side then it is a stereo file with one side silence, not a single monaural stream. If it is a single mono file then the same as a live input will occur, it will after input be turned into a mono signal for processing/metering. There's little point having the track as a single metered mono channel as very few effects have a clue what to do with a single input and makes things more fiddly than they need to be anyway. The net result is the same, given that most effects and the way the Live bus are working on stereo signalling.

Hope that helps.

[16 BIT]

Hi 16 BIT,

but doesnt this mean that mono channels which should only play one file then becomes a stereo channel playing 2 files. (pseudo stereo)

in principle, yes. When playing a physical mono audio file, the both channels of the Live's Audio track are fed with the same mono signal.

If this is correct doesnt this mean a waste of HD-CPU resources.?

The HD-resources makes no difference because in a mono channel there is only one channel of data to read from the disk. Concerning the CPU resources you are right.

Ive always wondered why a mono sample shows 2 green leds on the mixer when other daws I have used only show 1 (as it should be)

More than less the same answer, Live offers only stereo tracks, and therefore you have also two meters when you play a physical mono audio file.

I was loading some mono files from a Cubase project and they would only come out of one channel panned hard to the left. Nothing I did could make the signal come through both speakers. So I had to render, hit convert to Mono, import back in and then the signal played through both speakers BUT with 2 led lights indicating a stereo signal

I do not understand this. If you have a physical mono file you should hear it on both channels, but if you have a physical stereo file where the left channels is filled and the right channel is empty, you hear it only on the left speaker.
How looks the waveform of the mono file from Cubase? Is it really one channel?

regards,
Alex

Alex, thanks for taking the time to answer. Im not sure I quite understand but will probably need some time to absorb the info.

The cubase files were recorded in mono Im certain of that. But I will check the waveforms again.

[16 BIT]

The output of any track is always stereo. That's what the meters represent. The input to a track may be a mono signal from, say, a guitar, bass, etc and that signal can be set to mono by going to Preferences>Audio and hitting the Input Config button.

If the source is a Wav file then the same rules apply but are automatic. If a signal shows up on one side then it is a stereo file with one side silence, not a single monaural stream. If it is a single mono file then the same as a live input will occur, it will after input be turned into a mono signal for processing/metering. There's little point having the track as a single metered mono channel as very few effects have a clue what to do with a single input and makes things more fiddly than they need to be anyway. The net result is the same, given that most effects and the way the Live bus are working on stereo signalling.


I have recorded mono signals in to Live and had no problems there. This just came to my attention while importing Cubase and pro tools mono files.

Is the way Ableton Live handles audio files the same as other DAWs. Is this the principle that all daws work?

There's little point having the track as a single metered mono channel as very few effects have a clue what to do with a single input and makes things more fiddly than they need to be anyway.

Dont know about that. As well as Cubase Sx I also recorded a number of sessions on a friends pro tools rig and the way mono files were handled seemed very logical to me. For example, why was there mono versions of most of the plugins?, mono versions of reverbs, eq, delays etc.

Dunno to be honest?

Thanks for your time

[udp]

I render all my audio to mono late in a piece ( after saving a copy of the set),
this allows for greater control over track placement in the stereo field. I render with the efects on, after I pretty sure I'm done tinkering. It really help me at the mixing stage.

[16 BIT]

I render all my audio to mono late in a piece ( after saving a copy of the set),
this allows for greater control over track placement in the stereo field. I render with the efects on, after I pretty sure I'm done tinkering. It really help me at the mixing stage.

I understand your work method but its not really what Im talking about here to be honest. Still, you have reminded me that a mono sound with a mono reverb can sound pretty cool depedning on placement in the mix

cool

[gaspode]

I was loading some mono files from a Cubase project and they would only come out of one channel panned hard to the left. Nothing I did could make the signal come through both speakers. So I had to render, hit convert to Mono, import back in and then the signal played through both speakers BUT with 2 led lights indicating a stereo signal

I could be wrong... but it sounds like the Cubase 'mono' file is actually a stereo file with only a sound on the left channel... Load the sample up in sound forge or some other audio editor and see how many tracks you get.

[16 BIT]

I checked it and the files I recorded in mono are indeed mono. I sent alex's response to a friend of mine and he said what he told me is innacurate. I would like to post the email but I have to respect his privacy.

Im more confused than ever on this now.

Still dont understand why a mono file cant play as mono file without being rendered/coverted as a mono file??

Im sure Alex is correct though and perhaps this method is unique to Ableton. It concerns me because I cant get any more than 12-15 tracks on my laptop to play. I get much more from SX

Why is that?

[Alex]

Hi 16 BIT,

if you have a short one of these Cubase mono files you can send it to me, so I can check it.

regards,
Alex

[16 BIT]

Hi Alex,

My mistake

The files wasnt a cubase file its a Pro tools file. This would explain it I think?

However Im still confused at how Live handles mono files.

I was of the belief that if a mono file is duplicated the drive treats it as a stereo file (2 files). I dont get much tracks from my Laptop and thought that was perhaps the reason.

is it possible yu could explain in laymans terms whats happening.

Is a mono file in Live using less CPU HD resources than a stereo file?

regards

[sweetjesus]

the mono file will use less HD resource than a stereo file, but the same CPU resources.

[mikemc]

All the tracks in Live are stereo tracks, DJ-esque, that is just the way it is and it takes getting used to if you are used to using a PA or studio mixing board.

You can record a single channel (true mono) file into Live, it will pan it all the way R or L depending on what input you used on your iface. It is impossible to pan it as you'd like and maintain good quality sound in that case. So what you can do is use the "Utility" effect, select "mono", which will cause equal output on both channels, and then pan accordingly.