I hate days like this... layoffs

[inmazevo]

It had to happen, eventually.
We had a re-org a few months ago... new CEO... new upper-management... re-organized mid-management.

I figured at some point it would trickle down to our level, and apparently today's the day.
Actually, the three employees are in a closed office right now.

Not what I was expecting when I came in today.

3 out of 19 taken out in 20 minutes.
Bummer.

I've been working here for 9 years, and have watched us go from 175 to, now, 16.

Glad I have a job...
But - sucks.

Anyway.
Just a little venting.

- zevo

[Tarekith]

Been through that a couple times when I used to work in bio-tech, it's amazing how quickly they can let you go regardless of how good of an employee you've been. The corporate world can be cruel...

[H20nly]

^ no doubt.

they end up having to base it on weird shit because people say they're playing favorites if they don't. seniority is not always the best way though... but neither is performance because that can be extremely subjective... i don't envy any of them... those losing or those choosing.

[inmazevo]

If I remember correctly, this is the 6th or 7th time at just this company.
And yeah... they can just pull it out.
Sometimes its just simple numbers.

The first few layoffs here were just that: numbers. We either drop half the staff, or close the doors. That was right after I started, a few months after 911, and since we're an aircraft/software company, well... the business just died.
I sort of got that, and somehow didn't get the boot despite being a very new employee, and at the time didn't know people well enough to really miss anybody.

The next time was the most difficult.
I knew everybody, very well. Spent many a night up 'til 2AM to support a production roll, eating pizza and drinking with the dozen or so support folks. Spent tons of nights bar-hopping with everybody.
Then we had a re-org and rolled most of those jobs into significantly fewer people.

The next few were "voluntary" - meaning: they said we were dropping a certain amount of people, and whoever would go would get severance + a bonus and benefits for a few months. Wasn't really a bad deal, and since moral was pretty much broken, they got the volunteers each time.

But the last time was nearly 4 years ago.
We lost people through attrition, without replacements, but that was it.

Today I saw coming. We're prepping a new application, which is significantly different than the last, and it's pretty much a given that folks that don't appear (rightly or wrongly) up to the task of re-defining their skill set are out the door.

But it still sucks.

Thank God for wine.

- zevo

[Forge.]

it's funny and I don't mean to sound in any way unsympathetic - and it definitely says more about me, but I have never had a job where I would have felt really bummed to be "let go" - I guess I've mostly worked in a self employed kind of way, and the 'real jobs' I've had have mostly sucked, but 'real jobs' to me have always just been irritations that took me away from my music.

I've got used to not having a lot of money and just making do with what I have, but it means I can actually justify spending time on music.

But then I have no interest in owning a home or any of the major things that require a lot of debt, regular salary.... guess I'm a bit of a rolling stone in that sense, I like the freedom to just up and move to another part of the world easily if the need arises.... so I'm happy to rent....

I guess I'm just representing the other side of the coin.... sometimes losing a job is a perfect opportunity to do something better.

[Tarekith]

I've done both, the corporate thing for 10 years making a LOT of money doing relatively very little, and the self-employeed thing making ok money doing a lot more work. They both have their good and bad points.

One thing I learned in the corporate world is to always remember days like the OP is having. You can be let go at any time, for any reason, regardless of how hard or good a worker you are. Not saying you can slack all the time, but before killing yourself with too much work over a job like that, it bears remembering. I took every single sick day and vacation day I had every year, took full advantage of all the benefits available to me while I could.

[inmazevo]

I've done both as well.
In fact, twice as much of the free-spirit thing than the classically-responsible thing, actually.

Can't decide which I'd like better.
I have a wife, two kids and a mortgage... beyond that I can ditch anything, but I can't ditch that.
So I have to take it seriously.

On the other hand, I remember my free-spirit days not being as much of that as I'd LIKE to remember.
But still, I can't remember the last time I had a 10 hour 'session' without interruption for something I really wanted... a girl, a joint, whatever.
That rarely happens these days. Ah well...

Sort of miss it.
Sort of don't.

There was a time when my (now) wife wanted the same loose style of things (including the girl), but that changes once you've got too many commitments. As it should, I suppose.

I don't know.
I DO like the life of the lone music maker. I really, really do.
Day's like this remind me of how much simpler it seemed then. That's not the right wording. It only seems simpler now... seemed difficult then, actually.

Not unhappy at all.
Just bummed watching people walk out the door without even an attempt (or opportunity) to say bye, or good luck, or anything.
For money...

I hate (and love) money.

- zevo

[inmazevo]

Just a quick reply for Tarekith:
We're in the same city.

You can almost have both here.
And it's definitely a good (financial) ride if it lasts.

- zevo

[arctic ranger]

in the trades here, and layoffs happen all the time....can be shitty

[gjm]

I have been in the position of doing all the lay offs. Very hard thing to do, choose who is staying and who is going. I built a small manufacturing business from just myself to 12 people, then back down to just one again. Yeah, not a big player... when its that small you get to know everyone, very well. You have your favorites and you know who the lunch eaters are. You never want it to come across as playing with peoples lives, but sometimes there is just no convincing otherwise. Many employers are able through many means to distance themselves from the fall out of dealing with down turn. There are others though who really do wish it could be different for all involved. Best advice I ever got was from one of the first people I ever worked for... "just make sure that when you go they have to replace you."

[loydb]

I've been through it on both sides of the desk. Frankly, I found it easier to get laid off than I did to lay others off -- which is why I got out of management and went back to slinging code.

It sucks all around.

[senator adam]

Sucks man... This has been the subject of conversation at my work the past 2 months. My whole department got outsourced at a large telecommunications company. Half the people let go with severance, the other half told they have to join the new Indian contract company, and if they say no it's a voluntary quit with no severance/unemployment. What sucks is absolutely brilliant people that worked here for 15+ years got let go, and some lazy, incompetent people stayed. Totally random.

I'm on the Indian company now, and we're doing "knowledge transfer", which basically means we're training the people taking our jobs. Funny thing is, most people here are refusing to train them. Everyone would rather have the place crash and burn because of all this crap lol

Fuck it, it's just a job. Living in a beautiful city (Seattle as well), with wonderful people all around. No bombs dropping above like in so many other places... Could be a whole lot worse.

[andydes]

I was laid off just over a week ago after 8 years with company. Highly suspicious situation as the last two years we'd had by far the biggest profits ever, despite the recession. But a new MD started on the monday and announced redundancies on the tuesday. The reason given was sales in the first 3 months of the year were down on the previous 2 (record breaking) years. Basically, it was just the new boss coming in and stamping his authority on the place.

I was quite happy to take the payout and move on, but I have to wonder if it was worth all the ill feeling it generated amongst employees just to get rid of a relatively small number of people.

[beats me]

I wish we could all move into a Manson family type commune sans the murdering people in an effort to start a race war part. And music and drug fueled orgies with hippy chicks is a great thing at face value. There doesn't need to be a higher ideology behind it. Plus the music is better now. And if anybody gets any bright ideas that involves stockpiling weapons or going IPO we'll just lock them in the Upon Further Reflection Shed until they can come out and admit the idea was stupid.

Anybody have some undeveloped wilderness property they can donate?

[Styles Bitchly]

I truely empathize with those who have lost their jobs to layoffs or are in jeapordy of being terminated. I've never experienced it personally, but it must be one of the crappiest things to go through.

A brief little story...

When I was a young kid, I noticed "Made In Japan" enscribed on most of my dump trucks and other toys under the Christmas Tree. When I asked Mom what that meant, it was explained that Japan was just another place where elves worked on toys. Over the years, Japan faded and it became Malaysia...then Singapore...then Korea...and now China. See, the American industrialists and corporate types have been salivating over cheap labor ever since after WWII ...they sat back and watched while American tax dollars reconstructed Japan and then the epic era of outsourcing of U.S. jobs commenced...especially the manufacturing jobs. After a few decades or so, the standard of living starts improving in the "3rd World" region of choice and the cheap labor suddenly starts getting more expensive, so the industrialists pull up roots and move on to the next region.

So that brings us today. Most of the manufacturing jobs are gone, and likewise, the good paying white colar entry level middle-management jobs college grads used to take for granted are feverishly competed for on a 1 Job/50 applicants ratio. Four out of five college grads typically have to move back home because they can't support themselves and settle for management trainee at Golden Corral.
We're a Goods and Services economy now...the “multiplier effect” model has disintegrated….the flow of revenue is inbred. I clean your carpets and then spend the money I make on shocks for my Chevy at your muffler shop. Our primary exports are movies and high tech equipment. Most of our university level technical R&D is either stollen or sold to India, China etc. where the resulting product is realized. For every 20 containers we import through our ports, we export 1 container. Our natural resource and grain/food exports are the only tangible goods keeping us afloat in the world trade scene. The burgeoning U.S. trade deficit coupled with dependence on foereign oil telegraphs the dire consequences of a massive imbalance in the flow of global equity. Witness also the alarming trend now with state governments on the brink of bankruptcy, unable to pay bond obligations, civil services and invest in infrastructure projects…..can you say…crumbling bridges and roads? Why?.....simple….declining tax base due to loss of bellwether revenue sources such as factories, good wages, etc.

The moral of the story….I don’t know if some messiah will arrive on the scene and correct everything that’s wrong. However, the bottom line is this….nobody ever got wealthy or self-actualized working for “the man”. Most U.S. companies today are small businesses run by one or two entrepreneurs who took the risk and make all of the dough…everyone else gets minimum wage. The middle-large businesses have pretty much adopted routine purges/layoffs by design on some recurring frequency as a business strategy for keeping wages low and rooting out tenured staff making too much money. Pensions are a thing of the past and so is staff loyalty. We are rapidly becoming an economy of subcontractors. You have to grab the bull by the horns and take action. Don’t sit around in a job worrying every day about whether you’re next to get your pink slip. Zero in on an in-demand occupation and get yourself trained. The Health Care sector as an example is ripe with opportunity considering the aging Baby-Boomer throngs. If you live in a warm-humid climate, learn to be an Air-Conditioning mechanic. While you’re at it……start your own damned company…be a sole proprietor.

As Forrest Gump said…that’s all I’ve got to say about that.