Hardware Snobs

jp76 · Post by **jp76** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:12 pm

It seems like in a lot of interviews of electronic musicians I read there seems to be a bias against using computers, like, "oh, I still use a floppy disk sampler from 1991 and record to an ADAT." It seems like there's some kind of "integrity" that people seem to think goes along with this. Maybe it's an American thing, I don't know. Has anybody else noticed this? Almost like the quality of the music is judged on how hard it was to make.

hoffman2k · Post by **hoffman2k** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:21 pm

I think the hardware/software issue is a remainder from the mindset people had when computers weren't that powerful.
It's not an american thing. I think it's more universal.
Somehow related to the amount of money a hardware purist spent on all his material. Compared to the prices of software solutions.
These days they make synths that are as (im)perfect as the real thing.

I don't think there really is a non-discussable fact that proves the one is better then the other. It all comes down to what you prefer.

Cheers

B-

jer_mcclain · Post by **jer_mcclain** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:22 pm

people have to justify their invesment somehow;)

sweetjesus · Post by **sweetjesus** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:26 pm

im all for software, but analogue keyboards just give you a slightly different palette to work with. one that at the moment i like

jp76 · Post by **jp76** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:35 pm

People always seem to long for the good old days, I guess. I also think some people think that anything having to do with computers is bad or lazy or something. MPCs and hardware samplers are basically computers; they just look different.

JAMM · Post by **JAMM** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:43 pm

It,s a musician thing.
In the gitar world.. fender and Gibson are soooo great.

grt Jamm

ps:i have a fender

adhmzaiusz · Post by **adhmzaiusz** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:45 pm

i used to be one of those snobs
then i got my laptop and found out the sounds of software isnt as cheesy as i thought(depending on what u buy and how you use it)
and i also realized the benefits of not having the hassle of powering up like 20 different things just to make some sounds

ikeaboy · Post by **ikeaboy** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:00 pm

I'll hold my hand up and admit I was of the opinion hardware was superior to software, all the old arguments- dedicated software blah blah-n interface, latency, looking at a screen rather than using your ears etc, etc. Only recently did i ditch the dogma due to newer more powerful laptops which can be used in live situations and super stable software such as ableton. Although i will mantain learning to produce on an MPC with 32mb of sample memory helped shape my style. But i always mixed on a digital mixer and recorded into a soundcard! before this argument (look at old music Mags) was the "Drum machines are soulless and will never replace drummers" which turned out to be pointless, and now we have the digital verses analog summing argument, participate at your peril

drush · Post by **drush** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:13 pm

jp76 wrote:It seems like in a lot of interviews of electronic musicians I read there seems to be a bias against using computers, like, "oh, I still use a floppy disk sampler from 1991 and record to an ADAT." It seems like there's some kind of "integrity" that people seem to think goes along with this. Maybe it's an American thing, I don't know. Has anybody else noticed this? Almost like the quality of the music is judged on how hard it was to make.

funny, because more and more the people i read about and admire are talking about how much software has changed their entire musical process.

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:18 pm

Analogue stuff got copied to digital simulations because of the sounds .. which was pretty stupid IMO. I have a ton of Analogue gear and the best thing about it isn't its sounds its the GUI

Right next to me I have a Korg mono-poly whose filter controller is always where I expect it to be, if the lights were out I could find it easy.
press a key, turn a dial .. a nasty noise comes out.
While playing it live if the sound rips too much or too little - i can make tiny adjustments to the pitch of each OSC and the x- mod amount & the filter to modify it. I could do that within a second ... compared to on a soft synth where I usually turn what I think is the controller for the filter ... only for a completely different synth to suddenly shift 5 octaves

Analogue gear is so damn simple and each one produces aproximately 8 different sounds that after owning it for a few years it is foolproof. And I am a fool.

Before anyone acuses me of being anti digital, could I just point out what forum this is!

elemental · Post by **elemental** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:25 pm

Ha yes that old chestnut

YES software had done amazing things for music production, I use software about 80% of the time i'm making music...

However, for me there are still some areas where nice analog hardware can't be beat.
Fat analog oscillators and filters, software is close but not there yet. Analog still sounds warmer, more organic, stands out better in the mix (esp if recorded well).

Also, valve and tape saturation - software does a decent job of imitating, psp vintagewarmer etc, But still not the same.

Compressors - the UAD compressors sound the best out of all software compressors, I just wish I could hook one up to my laptop (without spending silly money on a magma thingy). When I've had the chance to use hi-end compressors, like old tube/valve compressors and the Distressor... they're in a different league. Bug bucks tho.

Another thing, hardware samplers often have nice chunky sounding converters which can go some way to making beats sound nice and fat.

basetwo · Post by **basetwo** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:27 pm

Wasn't the original question more about outboard digital hardware vs. software?

IMHO, the only reasons to have a bunch of outboard digital gear is if your CPU goes TANGO UNIFORM you still have stuff to work with, and 2) sometimes having a physical presence for control adjustment, etc, is just better than having everything in software.

Of course, for #2, midi controllers go a long way to help.

If it's already digital, I usually look for it first in a software incarnation. It's just more portable and flexible that way.

sqook · Post by **sqook** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:33 pm

Old hardware is expensive, therefore it can be made into a status symbol...

Zakari Luk · Post by **Zakari Luk** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:42 pm

software is a great thing, and it has improved my workflow, but it cannot and never will replace analog gear, maybe digital gear, but not analog.

im a guitar junkie, and i tell you that ive heard all the amp simulators (guitar rig, amplitube, emapple) and they cannot even come close enough to compete with my guitar setup. does that make me a snob? maybe so, maybe not, but i dont care, because my les paul with burstbucker pro pickups going into my gibson class a tube amp, in addition to all my boutique pedals, kicks the ass of any guitar software. its sad today that the standard of tone for guitar players is line 6.

guitar players- try the zvex stuff and you will know what im talking about. there is no software that can emulate a fuzz probe.

samplers and hard disk recording are the only things that are much more intuitive on the computer, as well as a few synths.

kabuki · Post by **kabuki** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:12 pm

I have noticed folks changing their tune (pun

)

It goes parallelle (sp) wi th the vinyl vs. digital DJ arguement.

IExampe: I was acting as a engineer, so to speak for a friend. He had an acquaintance that wanted to start "producing" house music.. I I firee up Live and give him the basic run-thru...Midi this, sample that, loop this, record that... beginners stuff. While I'm at it he keeps going on about how he already has a lable talking to him about putting out pressings (I'm thinking that "it must be a REALLY good lable to sign a guy that has never produced crap)

I point out that you caould DJ with Live as well. Of course (I wasn't surprised) he goes on regurgitating the same timred old "Real DJs only Use Wax" crap. I knew at that point I was dealing with a retard. The argument was pointless. Then when he started asking if I could give him a copy, and how his computer was stolen, along with all the software, I told him that Live was uncrackable and the people that have tried have been taken to court, etc etc...

I REALLY would hate for a tool like this guy to get Live.

I need to learn that my evangelical attitude is pointless for some folks. They will never get it...

PS. He also went on to brag about his VIP access to this certain club. A club with no cover, no line, no "back VIP room, ) I left as soon as he brought that up.

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