good sounds

scottanthony · Post by **scottanthony** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 10:48 pm

i have ableton live 4
went through all the patches, instruments (simpler, impulse) and have created a few loops and songs.

a few things are struggling for me though
1
- the beats...i have a pretty good sense of rhythm and think if i had BETTER or more sounds (reinforced), then it would sound so much better
2
-i need desperate help with bass sounds, and bass lines
3
-not enough intruments or timbres to explore the music i have in mind

what are some things that i can do? with software, hardware, instruments, samples, etc....
thanks for ANY help
s squared

anti-banausic · Post by **anti-banausic** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:04 pm

For more timbres, try layering effects and synths, ie. send one channels midi to another channel with another synth (or another instance of the same synth with a different patch). delay/reverb to taste.

I am still on the enormous learning curve for basses.

And especially, if you haven't already, have fun at www.kvraudio.com

Check out all the massive number of freebies, especially if you are on a PC, but also a lot of MAC stuff.

I think there is a site for MAC stuff, like osxaudio.com or something. But of this I cannot be sure. Best do a search of this forum for that.

Also, for beats and the like, there is a samples forum at kvraudio.com

Seriously, that site is the dogs' bollocks!

buzzcock · Post by **buzzcock** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:15 pm

If you're totally lost when it comes to basslines, try playing with something like

http://airy.andre.online.fr/AU/#au303

or its PC equivalent. Takes some of the thinking out of it & gets you started. Then you can elaborate from there (layering, editing, all that good stuff).

anti-banausic · Post by **anti-banausic** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:21 pm

Actually, I have plenty of synths that can get me decent bass tones. Muon Tau free is pretty good with decent eq'ing to get the tb303 sound. Also, Filtercape and minimonsta can give good basses. Even some good sampled basses with Wusikstation (attack bass is killer).

Even free Alpha with some tweaking will give some good bass.

I guess it is more the making the bass dynamic. There is a crazy thread over on KVR about psytrance basses. Not really what I do (more prog house, prog trance stuff but a bit mellower), but I gave it a shot and it is kinda difficult to get it sounding just so. Fun to try though.

Most of the time the issue is with not being so lazy to eq the kick and the bass appropriately.

TX.
Cheers.

drush · Post by **drush** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:41 pm

http://www.trackteamaudio.com/

ethios4 · Post by **ethios4** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:04 am

anti-banausic wrote: There is a crazy thread over on KVR about psytrance basses.

Found it!
Psytrance Bass

Harris.Andrew · Post by **Harris.Andrew** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:25 am

Just a note . . . I used to spend way too long eq'ing bass and kick, when what I really needed to do was use an eq-sidechain compressor . . . like the one ableton has handily included :p

corygilbert · Post by **corygilbert** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:46 am

errr. depends what your trying to do though, sidechaining is amazing for certain types of sounds, many styles, but some, like myself feel that sidechaining; like uneducated compression, leads to flat sounding mixes that defeat the point of the technique in the first place. No offense though he is absolutely right, making the bass and bdrum work together is key, pun intended, and kind of second nature in a live band, but too much in certain styles of music and you break the dynamic thread that creates tension, and thats just boring,
course if your doing house then its a good place to start.
I used to think the ibanez tube screamer sounded good too

MrYellow · Post by **MrYellow** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 4:13 am

http://www.futureproducers.com/tutorial.php/id/42

This article has some basic yet solid concepts.

I find using Bidule with a few VSTi's that focus on each element. I'll use
different synth engines for different parts of the bass sound and a mixer
to put them all together.

-Ben

anti-banausic · Post by **anti-banausic** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 5:32 pm

Thanks guys,

Will try the side-chain compression. Two other things though....

Minimonsta with just a little eq enhancement low is killing for basses right now. Really should check out this beast of a vsti.

There is an interesting effect that I have yet to try out that performs dynamic eq/filtering for when you have two sounds in the same sonic spectrum, but want one to be more prominant. It's called Space boy by a developer named elevayta. Check it out at kvr or on the web. Again, haven't tried it, but the concept seems really cool.

cheers.

anti-banausic · Post by **anti-banausic** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:54 pm

Harris.Andrew

Would you care to elaborate on a quick setup for the eq-sidechain for bass and kick? Nothing fancy, just something for a little pump?

Tx.
Cheers.

jeskola · Post by **jeskola** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 12:13 pm

anti-banausic wrote:Harris.Andrew

Would you care to elaborate on a quick setup for the eq-sidechain for bass and kick? Nothing fancy, just something for a little pump?

Tx.
Cheers.

Id be interested in that too! anyone ?

tone4407 · Post by **tone4407** » Thu Apr 28, 2005 11:11 am

anti-banausic wrote:Harris.Andrew

Would you care to elaborate on a quick setup for the eq-sidechain for bass and kick? Nothing fancy, just something for a little pump?

Tx.
Cheers.

Make that 3 of us! Help a brother out.

suburbanbather · Post by **suburbanbather** » Thu Apr 28, 2005 11:33 am

If you want BASS then try using a 40-60hz sine, saw, or square wave in simpler. As for drums- practice, practice, practice... I still suck at drum programing but I'm gradually figuring out how to get my to sound the way I intended.

Harris.Andrew · Post by **Harris.Andrew** » Thu Apr 28, 2005 7:12 pm

OK, here's what I do to just put a little extra low-end on a track. YMMV !!!! Experiment, use your ears

Send your bass, kicks, or other material you want to really put in the sub-/bass foundation to a send channel. Put in a compressor2, and an eq (3 is really easy, but not always the best . . . ). Monitor this send only.

Set the compressor2's eq to lowshelf, something bass-y. Like, anything above 250's not going to work, but anything in the range 80 - 250, it depends on the freq dynamics you want to follow. Then: Slam the track through; lower the threshold a bunch, put on a high compression ratio, like, 10 is good, maybe even more. Set the attack and release till it's just pumpin'. Then, on your eq plug, and maybe with the sidechain on the compressor, try to lower frequencies above, say, 200 or 300. The balance here is critical, but it's also ok to get a little extreme with the eq. For a basic default, you could just kill above 200-300.

Then - Turn on the rest of the track. Turn your send all the way down to -inf dB. Then slowly - slowly

- bring it up till you can just barely hear it. Do it again, etc. The idea is moderation. Again, there's a balance - this send will have a very, sort of squeezed, maybe to the point of flat dynamic; If it's above the mix, it will sound a bit crap, but if it's just below, it will reinforce.

Coceptually, the send fader becomes a control for low-end dynamic range; the higher the fader, the less dynamic range. And that's what you're shooting for.

Some notes: Watch out for stacking compression - two compressors at ratios A and B, theoretically have a ratio of A*B - so two upper-moderate 4's turn into an almost-limiting 16.

You can have high frequencies present in the send, e.g. 1k for tone and 10k for presence. Colorization of sound is an issue.

When using filters, watch out for resonance / ringing. This is why EQ 3 isn't always the best.

Don't belive this works? Check this track: http://www.sectionzmusic.com/detail.asp?SZID=18185 - Very moderate usage of this technique turned a kick / bassline that was, sort of all over the map, into something very smooth, and it responds well to automations of the kick / bass in the track. Now, there's a shameless plug !!

Want an exampier with a heavier-handed mixing style? http://www.sectionzmusic.com/detail.asp?SZID=18295 OH *SNAP* I did it again. Just a shameless plug.