RMS metering

[dabyt]

Hi!
In each track fader, there is the peak and RMS monitoring of the signal, but only peak numbers are visible. Is there any option to see the RMS values there? I don't want to use third-party plug-ins, but a way to compare RMS levels between tracks without changing between them.
About these RMS that Ableton shows, what type of RMS are? RMS K-12? RMS K-14? RMS K-20? Another? Knowing that would be very useful!
Thanks!

[Rolo Tomasi]

I can't see the instance where you would really need or want to compare RMS values on individual tracks. Maybe the master track if you're trying to get an average loudness value for your mix it might make sense in certain situations. In the digital world really the only thing that matters is that you don't go over 0 dBFS.

Perhaps you could explain more about your situation and why you would want per track RMS levels?

[TLW]

As I understand it K system metering is about setting and controlling the headroom between RMS and peak at the finishing/mastering stage, not a way of measuring RMS “average” value. And to work well it really benefits from a meter that behaves like an old-fashioned VU meter.

Live’s metering functions and plugin generally aren’t of the best - I use Melda’s metering plugin which can show multiple track plots at the same time which can be incredibly useful, plus the Klanghelm VU meter plugin and Waves VU meter sometimes.

As for knowing the RMS on individual tracks it can be useful to help see why a track isn’t as loud in the mix as the peak readings indicate it should be - such as a track with high transient peaks but an overall low average that might benefit from some compression to even things out. Sometimes things can even work out the other way round - a powerful bass with little difference between RMS and peak might be sounding much louder than the peak metering would lead you to expect.

[Da hand]

In the digital world really the only thing that matters is that you don't go over 0 dBFS.

This is not entirely true. Yes, you should not go over 0 dBFS, of course - that is the very first rule of the digital audio club - but then once you get past this very basic rule, this is where RMS and LUFS starts to matter wink:

I can't see the instance where you would really need or want to compare RMS values on individual tracks. Maybe the master track if you're trying to get an average loudness value for your mix it might make sense in certain situations.

While I agree that in the mix of one track, the individual track RMS values would not be always useful (although TLW makes some very good points as to why it could be useful) - they are useful for film work, for example - and for the Master output it is absolutely essential. There are hardly any instances of mastering a track where you are not looking at the RMS and LUFS levels vs Peak levels. Many broadcast and film standards demand RMS levels and now even online streaming is based around LUFS.

In projects where you are using any reference tracks, you need to match their average levels to the average levels of your track - this is where RMS levels on individual tracks would be useful, not just Peak levels.

Also, in projects where you are putting together an album, or compilation of tracks, or a mix - with each song on their own track - knowing average loudness values of each track would be useful.

[U.G.U.R]

Hi friends;

I tried to make techno music for two years.

I wanna ask something that I confused. In the mixing stage; ı used VU meter a lot. How many VU meter values should I see in VU meter for kick?? Now a days, I kept my kick -3 to -5 in VU meter, but ı sounds very quiet for me. When ı added the bass, ı allow 3 VU meter value up ( kick and bass sum: -2 VU meter). Because of this quiet kick, ı raised my VU meter volüme( 0 VU). Is that ok with you guys?? or you have suggestions for this??

I tried to keep my kick drum -12-18 db (peak level not VU). What dou you think about that?? Also, when I add my bass,, kick and bass were -12 to -15. If I dont do this, kick and bass are very quiet to me.

For compatible of kick and bass, what do you do in the mix stage for peak, RMS levels and VU meter (ıf you use)?

In mixing stage, LUFS levels that ı used- 22 to -20 LUFS, for mastering stage -14 and -15. what dou you think about this values?? or any suggestion??

Thank you so much.