Best companion VST to Live: Reason or Komplete/Maschine?

[MerkDak]

Hi Guys & Gals...

I started my setup with Ableton Live and the Maschine Jam: this gave me Live as my go to DAW and the Maschine + Komplete VST for sounds and sound design. As the Jam can switch between native control over Maschine and Midi to control Live, this was a pretty comprehensive setup. However...

Since then I've added some analog/semi modular monosynths that interface with VCV rack as a hybrid eurorack system. I find that I hardly use Maschine and I'd like to buy a Push. However, I feel that I would really miss all the instruments in Komplete (Massive, the sampled instruments & Drums). I do not have the physical and budgetary space to have both Push and Maschine in my setup and I don't think I can sell the Jam without the Komplete license.

Recently Proppellerhead brought out the VST version of Reason. I am not familiar with Reason, but I understand it is excellent. So, my question to you gals and guys: how does Reason (lite) compare to Komplete (select) compare to Reason (Intro) as a companion vst to Ableton Live and a hybrid modular? What are the pro's and con's of either, and which elements are essential?

My two choices right now are: sell Maschine Jam with the Maschine and Komplete bundle, trade it for a second hand Push 1 and Reason intro, orrrr make better use of the combo of Jam, Kontrol and my hybrid modular. Off course I could also go for a second hand Push 2, but that would cost me considerably more, so I'd have to skip the paid software for now. Do you see smart alternatives?

My full setup: Ableton Live 10 standard, VCV rack, Machine, Maschine Jam, Arturia Keystep, Midifighter Twister, Euro: Dreadbox Lil Erebus, Olitronk Micrón, Expert Sleepers ES-8, Behringer TD-3.

[jlgrimes]

Thats hard but my guess is Reason Intro if you are talking about the reduced versions, as you get Subtractor, Thor, Monotone, and Europa (+ samplers and Redrum) for $100.

Thats a decent synth collection which showcases a good bit of what Reason can do. Subtractor and Thor alone has plenty of patches.

That said Massive alone is pretty impressive but I'm not sure what else Komplete select would come with.



If you want a Modular though, Komplete might be better as Reaktor is a more capable modular environment although Reason would be much easier to wrap your head around i think. (I doubt if the full version of Reaktor comes with select).

Reason has some impressive modular packages too with REs. The Reason stuff would probably be easier to learn and probably get you going right out the box. Where Reaktor is more dense but customizable and powerful.

[siehorst]

HI,
I just gave reason lite a try, just to know what it is like, and had to face the fact, that each time starting reason, no matter if as standalone or as vst, I have been forced to switch online to verify my account.
No, not for me, sent reason back to the garbage.
horst

[jlgrimes]

HI,
I just gave reason lite a try, just to know what it is like, and had to face the fact, that each time starting reason, no matter if as standalone or as vst, I have been forced to switch online to verify my account.
No, not for me, sent reason back to the garbage.
horst

You can authorize it on one machine, where you won't have to go through that.

But yeah NI copy protection is more similar to Ableton's (which i like better).

[invisibledan]

Have you thought about trying Live Suite?

[MerkDak]

Have you thought about trying Live Suite?

Yeah. Two things stopped me so far: the price and the lack of a visual instrument interface. I find myself scrolling through lists and lists of presets in the browser, whereas having a visual representation of an instrument helps me find my way to making music faster. It's an inspiration thing, I guess...

Don't get me wrong, I love the Ableton workflow, just not so much for finding sounds.

[invisibledan]

Have you thought about trying Live Suite?

Yeah. Two things stopped me so far: the price and the lack of a visual instrument interface. I find myself scrolling through lists and lists of presets in the browser, whereas having a visual representation of an instrument helps me find my way to making music faster. It's an inspiration thing, I guess...

Don't get me wrong, I love the Ableton workflow, just not so much for finding sounds.

I get ya

[jlgrimes]

Have you thought about trying Live Suite?

Yeah. Two things stopped me so far: the price and the lack of a visual instrument interface. I find myself scrolling through lists and lists of presets in the browser, whereas having a visual representation of an instrument helps me find my way to making music faster. It's an inspiration thing, I guess...

Don't get me wrong, I love the Ableton workflow, just not so much for finding sounds.

The Ableton preset system grows on you after awhile.

I didn't really understand the Collections feature of version 10 when it came out but after working with it, it makes things very fast when finding/categorizing stuff. But yeah I hope Ableton improves on the concept in the future. They have a great foundation to build off of though. Live's GUI can be uninspiring for synths but about just right for certain devices as its very quick and fast to find stuff when you learn it. But yeah it probably isn't the best when handling a large amount of presets (although I like it for finding samples/plugins themselves).

Reason's browser is similar (but not as refined) to Ableton. But Reason's GUI while somewhat wonky is perfect for their synths as Reasons synths kind of promotes tweaking and experimentation more.

NI's system is Sexier though but at the same time has a higher learning curve but for browsing a very large amount of presets kind of necessary for Komplete as they have so many synths it would take a lifetime to really learn all the instruments. But NI makes some very powerful synths/samplers. Komplete Kontrol or Maschine integration of synths really shines though with integration (although Push 2 is no slouch) and is even more powerful with the huge number of 3rd party VST support for nks. Its only drawback is no VST3 support (which is slowly starting to become an issue with 3rd party).

[MerkDak]

Ok, so I know everybody is holding their breaths...

Kidding. I wanted to finish this thread with what I went with, why, and how I'm liking it, just in case someone else would have similar doubts.

I sold my Maschine Jam, bought a second hand Push 2 and I'm loving the crap out of it. As @jlgrimes mentioned, the Ableton browser/presets menu grows on you. Turns out that happens lightning fast when you have a Push 2; that screen and the integration is awesome!

My NI software is still functional, even tho I transferred the license to the new owner, which is good, because this gave me time to export the sampled instruments I use in my old tracks, so I still have the ability to edit/remix them later. I used TX16Wx and build some VST racks to be able to browse it from Push. Again, awesome.

I was looking to buy Serum or Massive, but right now I'm going to save up for Ableton Suite instead.