Sending a group / sub mix to outboard gear while retaining vsts

[neversleepforever]

Hi there, been trying to find a answer for this everywhere but couldn’t figure it out

Ideally I have a drum group (snare, kick , etc) and within that grouped track I have a vst compressor applied for a glue compression, I have each individual tracks, including the group being sent out to a hardware compressor and returned back to ableton to print. (External output 3/4 back into a new track 1/2)

While I’m able to get the grouped audio to hit the hardware compressor, the vst that is applied on the group becomes ignored.

I’ve also tried using the external routing vst but all I get is a feedback loop and I’ve tried these methods using only ableton plugins or only third party plugins with no resolve

What is the best way to send your grouped channel strip or bus while applying a vst on the group into a price of hardware gear and then back into the daw via interface ?

Many thanks

[RobrechtV]

I have each individual tracks, including the group being sent out to a hardware compressor

Do you mean you've routed each of the individual tracks within the group, as well as the group itself, to "Ext. Out"?

In that case, I think your solution will be to route the individual tracks to the group instead, and only the group to the external gear. That way, the signals of the individual drum parts will first go through the vst on the group and then to the external compressor.

If I read your description correctly, your individual tracks are now going straight to the external compressor instead of to the group, where the vst is.

[neversleepforever]

Hi there, thanks for the reply and my apologies on the delayed response.

Do you mean you've routed each of the individual tracks within the group, as well as the group itself, to "Ext. Out"?

Yes you read it correctly. I'll give the following a try.

In that case, I think your solution will be to route the individual tracks to the group instead, and only the group to the external gear. That way, the signals of the individual drum parts will first go through the vst on the group and then to the external compressor.

Is it not possible to have a group itself sent externally to hardware, when there are individual tracks within the group?

[RobrechtV]

Is it not possible to have a group itself sent externally to hardware, when there are individual tracks within the group?

Yes that is possible, and that is what I believe you should do. But I think you were sending all individual tracks directly to the external hardware, so they weren't going to the group.

If you set the destination of the individual tracks to the group instead, their audio will be 'collected' by the group and routed through the vst present on the group. Then, if you set the destination of the group to the external hardware, your external hardware will recieve the collected signals processed by the vst. I think that's what you're trying to achieve?

[neversleepforever]

If you set the destination of the individual tracks to the group instead, their audio will be 'collected' by the group and routed through the vst present on the group. Then, if you set the destination of the group to the external hardware, your external hardware will recieve the collected signals processed by the vst. I think that's what you're trying to achieve?

So what I've done in the past is: Have 5 individual tracks inside the group, and set their destination to the group and set the group's destination to external hardware — but for whatever reason the audio signal does not send when doing it within group. The only successful way I've been able to get audio to send into the external hardware is to send the destination for those tracks separately.

[neversleepforever]

Here's a screenshot of how I"ve done it in the past, where the group is being sent out of my apollo outs and back into a new stereo channel in 1/2
the group has a VST but the vst does not apply and I don't get any of the tracks coming into 1/2 unless I go and change their destination to 3/4

https://imgur.com/a/Hg9Zwqn

[RobrechtV]

That screenshot looks good, actually.

It sounds like you may have tried this, but what should really work is putting your vst in your "Drums" group, followed by an "External audio effect" device pointing to outputs 3/4 and receiving on 1/2. Then set the output of the "Drums" group itself to Master.

That way, the signal from the individual tracks outputting to "Drums" should be collected by the group, sent through the vst and then to the hardware effect and back. If that doesn't work, I'm not sure what's wrong.

[neversleepforever]

Hi Robrechtv

appreciate all of your responses.

Whenever I try the external audio effect I tend to get feedback loop.
I'll give this another attempt and see what happens.

I may be that Ableton, might not be the best DAW for routing audio to external sources and back into the daw.

Thanks again.

[RobrechtV]

Whenever I try the external audio effect I tend to get feedback loop.

In general: when using the External audio effect device, make sure that the tracks feeding into the hardware effect (your drum tracks, via the Drum group) are not actively monitoring the inputs where the effect comes back into Ableton Live (in your case, 1/2). That would lead to feedback.

In your screenshot, your drum tracks have input 1 as their source, but since monitoring is set to Off, you should not get a feedback loop.

[neversleepforever]

Will do, will give this a shot, Thanks again for your replies!