Cd samples and royalties HELP

zebastian21 · Post by **zebastian21** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:47 pm

hello....I use a lot of cd samples..but until now I wasnt aware of what i have to do if i want to use sounds from cd libraries for a commercial release. I have a deadline in a few days to make a remix, the people who hired me want to know exactly where my sounds are coming from.....my sounds are coming from lots of libraries ...what am i supposed to do? do i have to contact all the companies who made the loops im using for their permission?
do the sounds that came with Live 5 can be used for commercial releases?
i have deorganized my loops library in different cathergories rather than cd names....so finding what loop belongs to what company would be impossible at this point, i have over 60 gb of loops....
any input is apreciated folks

rikhyray · Post by **rikhyray** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 1:10 pm

You dont have to ask permission, but need to find the licence agreements for them and at least somehow reorganise the mess.
It would be probably impossible to list them all, depending how original /unique they are ( sorry to say most of these sample CDs are very unoriginal and very uninteresting). Usually at the end of the booklet you will find the license agreement , they are all different. Some may ask that you mention "....... loops and sounds by ................... courtesy of..........." usually that is not required in case of TV, commercials, even movies ( though might be different in case of soundtrack album).
It may cost you some work/time but better check all the CD and booklets for the licence agreements and invent some coding for the future. You never know how much it may costs if something goes wrong.

Chris J · Post by **Chris J** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 1:17 pm

also depends on the number of expected sales of your release.
Under 10000 I'd say you don't need to worry much, above that , yes reorganiztion is a priority, but only if the used samples are recognizable. If it's a drum loop, percussion etc, don't worry too much.
Vocals or licks are more problematic

zebastian21 · Post by **zebastian21** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 1:34 pm

great inputs guys.....this is my first remix with a contract signed, the record label who hired me is very small, just started. I dont know where my remix will get, but I dont want any problem in the future......
what about the live 5 Midi files?? can I use those???I used 1 percussion in my remix, but i dont see the rules for those sounds/midi files.

Chris J · Post by **Chris J** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 2:03 pm

yes you're safe with these

computo · Post by **computo** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 9:03 pm

Best advice, check EVERYTHING.

You do NOT want to be charged with Copyright infrignement, it could mean Jail time.

The Marx Brothers were jailed for the same crime.

I recommend you NOT take this lightly, and check yourself, or you could end up in some shit, and do you even want to worry about that?

Chris J · Post by **Chris J** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 9:26 pm

For sampling and not clearing Michael Jackson, making a #1 hit, being sued and not wanting to pay the millions you would owe, yes you could get jailed.

For a remix on a small label on a 3000 copies vinyl, using loops from sample CDs without licensing, you might have to go in the corner and count up to ten. That's the maximum.
I think you can sleep safely

Agent47 · Post by **Agent47** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 10:23 pm

Yeah I was wondering this as well since I am working on an album and will be mixing some original stuff with other tracks, do I need to pay a royalty up front for that or what? For samples I just alter them enough that no one can tell where they came from.

computo · Post by **computo** » Thu Aug 04, 2005 6:24 am

rather than listen to someone who obviously has NO experience researching this topic, like chris, you can listen to me, a college graduate, who has researched this far beyond reading the actual law. In case study, if you knowingly and willfully breach the copyright of a work, you can legally be jailed, and you could be liable for any money you MIGHT have MADE from the sales of said copywritten material...SO even if those recording dont sell, the money you COULD have made can be collected.

I suggest you think twice before sluffing off responsibility in this category.

SethAbare · Post by **SethAbare** » Thu Aug 04, 2005 7:39 am

computo wrote:rather than listen to someone who obviously has NO experience researching this topic, like chris, you can listen to me, a college graduate, who has researched this far beyond reading the actual law. In case study, if you knowingly and willfully breach the copyright of a work, you can legally be jailed, and you could be liable for any money you MIGHT have MADE from the sales of said copywritten material...SO even if those recording dont sell, the money you COULD have made can be collected.

I suggest you think twice before sluffing off responsibility in this category.

Best advice is not to listen to people on the internet

But since you're asking for it, startup record companies lack the experience that older labels might be able to offer you. Probably this is the paranoia of an unexperienced record label owner. The likelyhood of anyone going to jail for 10,000 units and under is so minute and unlikely that you might as well play the lottery right now. If you are truly worried about the samples then simply hire a lawyer to review the terms of use included with your purchased sample packs, you did buy them right? You have enough money for a lawyer? Better not put your name and address on the discs if you answered no to either of those. Things have a way of coming back to you.

Ask your record label manager to provide a lawyer to verify the cd's TOU (terms of use), if he says he can't afford that (which he can't) just provide him with a general list of your sample cd's and photocopy/fax/scans of the TOUs. Only the most anal-retentive record label would require anything more than this.

60gb of samples eh? Yarrr!

Chris J · Post by **Chris J** » Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:44 am

computo wrote:rather than listen to someone who obviously has NO experience researching this topic, like chris, you can listen to me, a college graduate

don't get nasty computo. Give us some example instead of blowing wind. If you look at my posts you'll see that I don't give advice on stuff I ignore which is 99,99% of the threads. But this happens to be a subject I have to know because of the type of music I make and the number of records I've released, and carefull questionning to record companies on that subject.
So instead of dismissing me, Mr Graduate who knows it all on paper, give us an example of someone who's used samples from sample CDs without licensing, released a record on a small label and got jailed for it.
I'll kiss your feet if you do.

DJRetard · Post by **DJRetard** » Thu Aug 04, 2005 9:23 am

Check the liner notes of the CDs you got the samples from. Ive seen a couple of nasty ones out there that do require permission. Never buy one of those, thats just daylight robbery. Im betting all you CDs are copyright free so you will be fine.

keep in mind even if fyou used an eminem sample the time and effort to have it removed from a release is not worth the bother of even the largest labels especially if their taking on a small label. The large label will gain nothing. usualy they will just demand a higher share of the publishing to save face. Fair enough.

Your label sounds a little paranoid. Unless you have some obvious sample over it you have zero to worry about. Ive used countless samples from other peoples work over the years on releases. The only one I got in to trouble with was Kate Bush. She doesnt like to be sampled

computo · Post by **computo** » Thu Aug 04, 2005 7:45 pm

yo, labels should be scared, they are the ones who retain the masters, so THEY are the ones who will be sued first, then THEY will sue YOU, for breach of contract!

I did give you an example, the Marx brothers.

AS far as a small label, I am NOT a lawyer, and I do NOT keep up with current precendent, HOWEVER, Im sure you all are familiar with the tale of the Italian DJ who was arrested for DJing with all illegal mp3s. he didnt even use those samples on recordings, they didnt go after his label, they went for him.

Like I said, watch your ass...Its nothing nasty, Just dont be lured into a false sense of security by someone with little to no knowledge on the subject. Its not what they've done, but what they CAN do. Regulation is a bitch.

Chris J · Post by **Chris J** » Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:09 pm

you're saying the Marx bros got jailed for using unlicensed samples from a sample CD on a small label release.
you're a joke, man !

Chris J · Post by **Chris J** » Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:30 pm

computo wrote: Im sure you all are familiar with the tale of the Italian DJ who was arrested for DJing with all illegal mp3s. he didnt even use those samples on recordings, they didnt go after his label, they went for him.

a shame you didn't understand the question, that would have prevented you from mixing the only 2 cases you remember about copyright infringment with a question about sample CDs.
but thanks for your help, i've learnt a lot from someone who knows.