Drum Rack question, I'm very disappointed.

[Olga]

Hello, long time user first time poster. I just upgraded from 5 to 7 and really liked the idea of the Drum Rack plugin to replace Battery. But after using it and loading it with sounds I'm not seeing any SENDS on all the separate tracks when Drum Rack is unfolded! ? ! ? ! Without sends on each separate drum sound/track this makes Drum Rack basically worthless for drum programming and mix down. Subbing out drum groups is a huge part of the mix down process for me and without this ability its a load of junk. Is this possible with Drum Rack? Am I missing something, not seeing the sends? Something I'm supposed to do down in the rack to send them to a bus? Or is this impossible now and hopefully coming up in an upgrade?


Thank you for your time.


Olga

[mike holiday]

you can route any chain in a rack to a new audio track, similar to using multiple outputs for impulse in v5

the drum rack is ultamitly just one track

[lukas412]

the drum racks have built in sends and returns. its in the manual.

[Tarekith]

Right below the rack chains.

[Olga]

Thank you boys thank you thank you!

[blank]

the drum racks have built in sends and returns. its in the manual.

And this is awesome ! but sometimes, just sometimes, a bit confusing and painful to navigate in.

[onebluesphere]

I have been using live for a year and I do not have the slightest idea what sends and returns are for.
Obviously, I don't make a living out of this. It is only a hobby.
But, I would be very pleased to hear a simplified explanation about it.

[roby]

A typical use of a send and return bus is adding a reverb plugin to the return bus track, setting the the reverb's mix to wet, and then sending audio to the track to be processed by the reverb by turning up the track's send knob the corresponds to the return track. This way you can have one reverb plugin processing several tracks instead of loading a reverb plugin on every track that needs reverb.

[Tone Deft]

was going to post the wikipedia entry but it's awful.


there are two ways audio can leave a track, out the master (or whatever you set in that drop down box) or to a send channel.

as you learn to mix there are two general parts of the mix, stuff specific to one track like a chorus or phaser or distortion, really distinct sounds that make that track sound like that track. then there's stuff like compression, reverb, limiter, EQ etc that you want to put over groups of tracks, for those you use a send.

look in you manual for the pre and post send fader setting. this decides if the volume of the signal you send to a send is before or after the fader. with this you can turn a fader all the way down but still have the send play full volume, 100% wet. or the signal going to the send follow the track's fader.


most of all, fire up Live and go check it out yourself.

[Olga]

I have been using live for a year and I do not have the slightest idea what sends and returns are for.
Obviously, I don't make a living out of this. It is only a hobby.
But, I would be very pleased to hear a simplified explanation about it.

Massive attack on drum sounds is only achieved with bussing drums to return tracks. Especially in electronic music and especially with the kick and snare. The more you bring out the snap-pop with a kick and snare using a compressor the more you destroy the overall sound of your kick and snare and are left with nothing but a click-pop. So, the trick is to leave your main kick and snare tracks alone compression wise and just eq them only. Then, you send them to a return track and compress them heavily on that return track creating a sharp pop-click quality making them snap hard just on the return channel. Then you gently bring this return up in the mix until your happy with the sound. So now you have your kick and snare left alone on their own tracks so they can be at their full length and sound and on your return track it is compressed very sharp & hard. You then carefully blend them all together and get a very full, rich snappy sound.


Olga

[andydes]

was going to post the wikipedia entry but it's awful.


there are two ways audio can leave a track, out the master (or whatever you set in that drop down box) or to a send channel.

as you learn to mix there are two general parts of the mix, stuff specific to one track like a chorus or phaser or distortion, really distinct sounds that make that track sound like that track. then there's stuff like compression, reverb, limiter, EQ etc that you want to put over groups of tracks, for those you use a send.

look in you manual for the pre and post send fader setting. this decides if the volume of the signal you send to a send is before or after the fader. with this you can turn a fader all the way down but still have the send play full volume, 100% wet. or the signal going to the send follow the track's fader.


most of all, fire up Live and go check it out yourself.

You use sends for eq? That's a bit unusual isn't it?

Compression too is usually used as an insert as well is it not? Except for the case Olga mentions, which I keep forgetting to try out (thanks for reminding me).

Personnally, I only really use sends for reverb, sometimes delay.

You can select several chains in the drum rack and right click to group the drums into a sub rack. This allows you to place insert effects like eq on serval drums at once.

But for sends, click the button on the left of the drum rack to show return tracks and drop effects in there. Only when effects are in place will the sends be shown in the mixer. I believe they can also be routed to the main session return tracks.

[onebluesphere]

Thanks Everybody, I had return and send tracks hidden since the first day because I did not know what they where for so, I will start experimenting with them with the advices you gave me.
Thanks again for your time.