Live 9 and audio dropouts with USB soundcard

[Peazy]

I have the same problem with macbook running El Capitan and NO EXTERNAL HARDWARE, CORE AUDIO and NO PLUGINS and mixing a very simple project consisting of 4-5 midi tracks and 3 audio tracks. Every 8-10 seconds the audio pops and skips. Sometimes it's fine for 2-3 minutes, then without any additional changes other than volume/pan adjustments, it'll start popping and skipping again, rendering ableton completely useless on my macbook. Tomorrow I throw it off the balcony and go back to my pc where ableton functions in a passable manner, albeit rarely at 100%.(random crashes, random midi leaks, inconsistent latency) Bigwig or is starting to look like a viable option.

[Stromkraft]

We really are missing a tool to analyze this kind of issue on Macs.

[Stromkraft]

Currently on a newer Mac on OSX 10.11.6 El Capitan and Live 9.7.3. I’ll try 9.7.4 tomorrow.

I have the same problem with macbook running El Capitan

Why are you guys not even contemplating macOS 10.12 "Sierra"? Long standing Coreaudio bugs were fixed in this version. While that may not affect your specific problem it should be worth a try at least.

[jamief]

Had the same issues with http://www.allen-heath.com/ahproducts/xonedb2/
Pain in the r S.

[Stromkraft]

Had the same issues with http://www.allen-heath.com/ahproducts/xonedb2/
Pain in the r S.

What OS specifically?

[mattoutlaw]

Why are you guys not even contemplating macOS 10.12 "Sierra"? Long standing Coreaudio bugs were fixed in this version. While that may not affect your specific problem it should be worth a try at least.[/quote]

Sorry I missed this a couple months ago. I've had this issue on two different Macbook Pro's, a 2011 with 10.8.5 and a 2015 with 10.11 El Capitan. The same problem persists with any Live version starting with 9.6.2, so I left the OSX alone for the time being.

I'm confident that it's either a MOTU problem, or Network Midi problem, or a combo of the 2. Unfortunately, there's no feedback or indicators in the Ableton window (top right) or Activity Monitor that give any clues. I've disabled Network Midi on the A machine, and only sent the commands from the B machine. And neither has had dropouts in about 8 shows. So we'll see.
Again, we've gone as many as twelve 90-minute shows or so, with no problems. Then it will randomly drop out and become out of sync. So this problem has been a huge pain to sort out.

Our previous interface was an older Thunderbolt AJA video interface. Perhaps USB has just been jacked for years. My MOTU's are firewire capable, maybe I'll give that a shot.

Thanks for any insight you guys have, and have already given.

[fishmonkey]

btw, if the issue is with the audio interface, then there will be relevant error messages in the Console logs.

also, it only takes a tiny processing stall to cause an audible glitch, and it is very unlikely that you would see the offending activity in the Activity Monitor or in the Live GUI...

[HorstBlinth]

what helped - at least 90 % for me was some instructions I had received from the motu support, not sure I can attach them here... So, I dare to past it all here... For me the manual driver de- and reinstall (at the very end) was most effective.

MOTU Pro Audio interface troubleshooting macOS
1.) Reset- in rare circumstances, it’s possible for the unit to
become “wedged” or “frozen”. Resetting the unit will often resolve
the issue. To learn how to reset your unit, visit http://motu.com/
techsupport/technotes/reset. A rest will delete any custom
configurations or presets. Be sure to export any custom preset
files to your computer before the reset.
2.) Cable- a bad cable can cause a number of unusual problems.
Be sure to test multiple USB and/or Thunderbolt cables.
Additionally, you will want to test connections to all USB or
Thunderbolt ports on the computer.
3.) USB Hub- USB hubs are notorious for causing connection
issues. If you must use a hub, we recommend using a powered
hub. When troubleshooting, make sure to take the hub out of the
signal path and connect directly to the computer’s USB port. The
same principal applies when daisy chaining via a Thunderbolt
dock. Remove any additional Thunderbolt devices when
troubleshooting.
4.) Driver- make sure you are running the latest version of the
MOTU Pro Audio driver for macOS. The installer is available on
motu.com/downloads. Be sure to restart your computer after the
installation process has finished.
5.) Firmware- the web control app will notify you when a new
update for your device is available. MOTU Pro Audio interfaces
have a fail-safe mechanism that will prevent damage to the unit in
the event of a power disconnect during the firmware update
process. It is extremely unlikely that an unsuccessful firmware
update will cause the unit to fail. Make sure to connect the unit to
the computer or router via ethernet to update the firmware. For
the UltraLite mk4 and 828es, the firmware can be updated via
USB. We recommend staying up to date with our latest updates.
6.) macOS High Sierra- the macOS High Sierra update adds an
extra layer of system security. Third party drivers now require
manual activation. If you are running macOS High Sierra, be sure
to open the Security and Privacy page in System Preferences and
click “allow” for any MOTU drivers you wish to use.
Additional suggestions:
7.) Web app access- if you experience trouble accessing the web
control app, open your browser and type ‘localhost:1280’ in the
address bar at the top of the window. This will open the web
control app for any devices that are locally connected to the
computer via USB or Thunderbolt. If your device is connected via
ethernet, type in the unit’s IP address in the address bar. The IP
address for the interface will be displayed on the front panel LCD
when pressing the “ID” button on the front panel.
8.) USB class compliant mode - your MOTU Pro Audio interface
will function via the class compliant USB driver that is built into
macOS and iOS. If you’ve installed the MOTU Pro Audio Driver,
you can force the unit to operate via USB class compliant mode.
To do so, power off the Pro Audio interface, find the Extensions
folder (System HD/Library/ Extensions) and drag the
MOTUProAudio.kext file to the trash. Restart the computer and
then power on the interface. To use the MOTU Pro Audio driver,
simply run the Pro Audio installer available on motu.com. Note
that USB class complaint mode is not possible via Thunderbolt.
9.) Digidesign Drivers- old Digidesign or AVID audio drivers
have been known to cause conflicts with our Pro Audio driver. Be
sure to remove any dated Digidesign drivers if you suspect a
driver conflict. Go to the Extensions folder (System HD/Library/
Extensions) and delete any files with the .kext extension that
contain the word “Digidesign”.
10.) Refresh Preferences- to restore the Discovery App’s
preferences, quit the Discovery App and go to the User Library
folder (hold the Option Key while clicking on the Finder's "GO"
drop-down menu, select Library, then open the Preferences
folder). Find the file named “com.motu.MOTUDiscovery.plist” and
drag it to the trash.
11.) Manual driver remove- to manually remove the Pro Audio
driver, trash the following files:
Macintosh HD/Applications/: MOTU Discovery.app Macintosh HD/
Applications/: MOTU Audio Tools.app
Macintosh HD/Library/Application Support/MOTU/: ProAudio
Macintosh HD/Library/Extensions/: MOTUProAudio.kext
Macintosh HD/Library/Audio/MIDI Drivers/:
MOTUProAudioMIDIDriver.plugin Macintosh HD/Library/Audio/
Plug-Ins/HAL/: MOTUPROAudioServerPlugin.driver Macintosh
HD/ Library/LaunchDaemons/:
com.motu.proaudio.HTTPServer.launchd.plist

[mikb]

6.) macOS High Sierra- the macOS High Sierra update adds an
extra layer of system security. Third party drivers now require
manual activation. If you are running macOS High Sierra, be sure
to open the Security and Privacy page in System Preferences and
click “allow” for any MOTU drivers you wish to use.

This was a bit confusing statement of MOTU as the last sentence must address the installers of said drivers, not the drivers themselves.

[HorstBlinth]

This was a bit confusing statement of MOTU as the last sentence must address the installers of said drivers, not the drivers themselves.

I am not sure what are are referring to. However, this instruction (extra security on High Sierra and the "allowing") means that you have to do this on the Mac OS security screen after installing the driver (it's also in the instructions of Motu) - I understood that you "only" have only 30 min time after installation (and required restart) of the drivers when installing the first time (I had to do so, but only for midi drivers); otherwise the driver installation is not completed (and active). It's a general instruction/requirement, not specific to a particular driver.

Did you mean that?

[mikb]

This was a bit confusing statement of MOTU as the last sentence must address the installers of said drivers, not the drivers themselves.

I am not sure what are are referring to. However, this instruction (extra security on High Sierra and the "allowing") means that you have to do this on the Mac OS security screen after installing the driver (it's also in the instructions of Motu) - I understood that you "only" have only 30 min time after installation (and required restart) of the drivers when installing the first time (I had to do so, but only for midi drivers); otherwise the driver installation is not completed (and active). It's a general instruction/requirement, not specific to a particular driver.

Did you mean that?

Yeah, but did you actually mean the drivers are visible in this system preferences panel, like an app or something? And then they're not? I've never heard of this time-limited behaviour, so I assumed MOTU talked about overriding the default setting for an installer without an Apple developer ID, i e not the driver itself. I still see no clear indication for this 30 minute feature, but if you have some other info on this way of installing I'd be willing to learn more. I can't find anything searching.

[fishmonkey]

This was a bit confusing statement of MOTU as the last sentence must address the installers of said drivers, not the drivers themselves.

I am not sure what are are referring to. However, this instruction (extra security on High Sierra and the "allowing") means that you have to do this on the Mac OS security screen after installing the driver (it's also in the instructions of Motu) - I understood that you "only" have only 30 min time after installation (and required restart) of the drivers when installing the first time (I had to do so, but only for midi drivers); otherwise the driver installation is not completed (and active). It's a general instruction/requirement, not specific to a particular driver.

Did you mean that?

Yeah, but did you actually mean the drivers are visible in this system preferences panel, like an app or something? And then they're not? I've never heard of this time-limited behaviour, so I assumed MOTU talked about overriding the default setting for an installer without an Apple developer ID, i e not the driver itself. I still see no clear indication for this 30 minute feature, but if you have some other info on this way if installing I'd be willing to learn more. I can't find anything searching.

here you go:

https://developer.apple.com/library/con ... TS40017658

[mikb]

here you go:

https://developer.apple.com/library/con ... TS40017658

Great! Thanks, Fishmonkey. Aha, so it's a macOS 10.13 feature. No wonder I didn't see this likely because I haven't updated to that version yet.