"cohesive" sound....or how to not sound amatuer

[Jekblad]

killer post from Angstrom.

[Heretic]

the key to getting a non-amateur sound is not in using effects to try and 'beef' up the sound (IE layering reverb and delay), that just clouds the sound. The trick is in choosing sounds well in the first place. It's in understanding sound, how the ear hears natural sounds and what it finds horrible in natural sounds.

I find that the best possible outcome is from as few sounds as possible, each with a good amount of subtle harmonic variation on each hit / note. There should be harmonic 'interest' within the sound, nothing too overtly dramatic like resonant filtersweeps, I mean - imagine how a real kick drum subtly resonates the nearby snaredrum, and how the bass cab (of the bassist) can also resonate the kit. That sort of stuff makes the whole band sound both unified as an audiosource, but it also makes the notes and hits harmonically detailed.

Try really imagining what would happen if you played a 303 through a rig in a club, there would be resonance at certain points, the aircon ducts would vibrate horribly at another frequency, the bar glasses would shake at some other frequencies. Now, to make that whole experience work for you (as if you were really there), you would make a riff up that capitalised upon those resonances. Then, for that occasion and location, that 303 riff would be truly in resonance with its environment - it would be 'fat' in a synergistic way. Yet it would still be simple.

So, you can use effects to synthesize that unification of instrument and a 'virtual environment', but don;t be waylaid into the world of "just put some reverb on", because that's missing the point.

I think perhaps this idea may be too much for a web forum!


essentially : a few things working well together makes for powerful simplicity.

wow

[anachroschism]

I know on that post from angstom, makes more sense every day i think about it again or apply it in new ways.

Re-evaluated whole process for this new track because of that post, stripping efx off and dropping the percussion i built for it. Simple re-work/looped edit now.

[Akshara]

Echoing the power of simplicity, less is often more.

Sound design and mixing is an art of illusion, much like with film. Translating the quality and perception of an experience can be more effective than an accurate representation of the thing itself.

Give yourself permission to try things that don't make sense. Subtracting a large bandwidth of EQ from an instrument which might make it sound 'wrong' when soloed could help fit it into the larger mix beautifully.

[TRS80]

sidechain compression is my favorite way to thicken the soup

[Jarvisimon]

I'm surprised that nobody's mentioned giving your ears a rest yet.

We get accustomed to sound quite quickly so we no longer can properly hear what is going on.

Give yourself a break every couple of hours, even start on something new and get back to this one in a few days.

It may not be the complete answer but it's not going to harm your creativity.

Alternatively, when you get good with your tools, try and finish things in rapid time not giving yourself a chance to overcook things.

[snakedogman]

it would be helpful if you could post a sound example of something you're working on and what you think the problem is with it.

[anachroschism]

will do snakedogman should have rough cut done today.

+1 for giving your ears a rest, thankfully I have ADD so doing something else is real easy. Too bad i never seem to finish anything though. And getting through it quick is a good idea but damn near impossible for me, have you SEEN hoow many presets and efx there are? my god i need to hear all of them right now.......you want me to, like, focus? HAHAHAH

[whenchyiv]

EQ and compression (in this order)

I think you mean compression and then EQ.

[josephjobling]

EQ and compression (in this order)

I think you mean compression and then EQ.

ahhhh how many times have i seen that dibate

[whenchyiv]

EQ and compression (in this order)

I think you mean compression and then EQ.

ahhhh how many times have i seen that dibate

There's nothing to debate. If you want to cut something pre-compression so the compressor doesn't act on it, thus maximizing the amount of compression on the frequencies you want in the sound, then put the EQ before the compressor. If you want your EQ settings to stay put then put the compressor before the EQ. If you don't the compressor will respond to the EQing you've done and alter the way you've brought up or attenuated various frequencies. Of course you may have a happy accident and have that sound better on occasion (and if it does then go with it!), but you usually want your EQ settings to stay where they are instead of being messed with unpredictably by the compressor.

[anachroschism]

thanks squidgee, was wondering how to best set up the position of certain effects on a chain. compression then eq makes sense, as the compression should ideally affect the entire audio and from there go ahead and eq or tweak away. I will be putting compression first in line from now on, see how it goes.


Oh, and i still am having mad trouble warping in 8, my god.....partly because the musicians on the song im warping suck and and dont stay steady(no ?uestlove here) and partly becuase im trying all the differnt variations and ways of warping. Just found out about right-click quantitize so there goes another few hours messing around....